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1731 Views 7 Replies Last post: Dec 22, 2013 9:48 PM by MikeHardman RSS
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Dec 21, 2013 5:23 PM

several moth ID's required please?

Hi All,


I have been working through my moth pictues from this year trying to ID several that remain UFOs at this point! Any help with IDing any of the below would be very much appreciated?


Most I'm struggling with as they are very poor pictures so apologies for this but sometimes you only get one chance and a big crop!!











DSC_0022 (2).JPG








DSC_0029 (2).JPG



Many thanks



  • Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 21, 2013 10:26 PM (in response to Higgy)
    Re: several moth ID's required please?



    Some of these are tricky, and you don't help by keeping the dates, locations and sizes secret!

    As it is, I am presuming they are all British.


    1. probably Celypha lacunana (; Phiaris micana, Epinotia nanana and Rhyacionia pinivorana are a similar but not quite right

    2. a bit like Catoptria furcatellus (, but your has no/short palpi and a pale collar/head...; also a bit like Pima boisduvaliella ( - but neither of those is close enough

    3. perhaps Crambus perlella ( (the palpi are too long for Udea uliginosalis)

    4. rush veneer, Nomophila noctuella (

    5. probaby Amblyptilia acanthadactyla (; it is somewhat variable

    6. Acleris sparsana (; also a bit like the grey phase of bilberry tortrix Aphelia viburnana (

    7. dark chestnut, Conistra ligula? (

    8. a pug but none of my candidates is good enough (brindled pug, Eupithecia abbreviata; oak-tree pug, Eupithecia dodoneata; slender pug, Eupithecia tenuiata; double-striped pug, Gymnoscelis rufifasciata); perhaps mottled pug, Eupithecia exiguata ( is the closest

    9. ?

    10. possibly the uncertain, Hoplodrina alsines (



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      • Currently Being Moderated
        Dec 22, 2013 8:37 AM (in response to Higgy)
        Re: several moth ID's required please?



        Considering the location and date data:


        1. ditto

        2. definitely not Catoptria furcatellus, and also not Pima boisduvaliella - so I don't know

        3. supports Crambus perlella

        4. ditto

        5. ditto

        6. ditto

        7. ditto

        8. ditto - flight period wrong for all I hinted at

             These are OK for flight period:

             - Eupithecia inturbata (

             - Common Pug, Eupithecia vulgata (, but no white sub-terminal line

             - Maple Pug, Eupithecia inturbata (, but scarce

             - Tawny Speckled Pug Eupithecia icterata (, markings not quite right

             - Plain Pug, Eupithecia simpliciata (

             But I still don't find a good match, though I am leaning towards E. inturbata or vulgata

        9. ditto - I don't know (hints a bit of lesser yellow underwing, Noctua comes, but the wings are too broad)

        10. I think Hoplodrina blanda slighty more likely


        Yes - let's see the others...


        BTW, I guess you are Jeff of and

        If so, keep up the good work!



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          • Currently Being Moderated
            Dec 22, 2013 4:43 PM (in response to Higgy)
            Re: several moth ID's required please?



            Gymnoscelis rufifasciata

            Ah - the second brood, in August - good point. A relatively tired/old specimen would look like yours (eg.

            So - yes, I think that's a good ID.


            1. (I think your 11. is a typo?)

            It is a silver Y, Augrapha gamma (; there are a few recognized colour forms, but yours is just a nice fresh specimen.

            I don't know of a 'beautiful silver Y'... There is a 'beautiful golden Y', Autographa pulchrina (, but yours is not that.


            2. Clepsis or Epiphyas; in this case, I think you are right; I think it is a light brown apple moth, Epiphyas postvittana (


            3. Agriphila latistria (, but missing its palpi...


            4. Underwing, you suggest... I don't think so. Noctua pronuba always (despite a lot of variation) has the dark marks nearthe tip of the forewing. N. janthina is closer, but still not right.

            Neglected rustic Xestia castanea ( perhaps.


            5-7. ?


            8 I fancy marbled beauty, Cryphia domestica ( ) rather than marbled green


            9. It looks somewhat like Pandesma robusta (, but that is extremely rare.


            10. Bright-line brown-eye, Lacanobia oleracea ( despite the flight period being not quite right


            11. ?


            12. Same as 2, I think



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              • Currently Being Moderated
                Dec 22, 2013 9:48 PM (in response to Higgy)
                Re: several moth ID's required please?



                9. Pandesma robusta is only a stab in the dark; there are probably much more likely possibilities; it is just unclear to me which ones to suggest.

                The single record of this species in the UK is decribed here


                You will note it mentions the ID of that specimen was done by a chap at the NHM.


                I note that the Entomological Record's Contents and Special Index for 2010 includes Pandesma robusta (pp.176,177,179,180), but the journal itself is not online, so I can't check that out further


                It may, of course, refer to the above-mentioned record.


                Further work would involve close comparison of your specimen with multiple examples of the comparator species, looking for points of similarity/difference, especially concerning the wings (size!, shape, markings), legs (markings and ornamentation), antennae (shape of segments; microscope probably needed), palpi (size, shape). If a dissection microscope was to-hand, one would also inspect the genitalia (a rather specialist skill).

                Since the specimen was well worn and only photos exist of it, a significant chunk of that would is now impossible. In such cases, a reliable ID (if any) may be impossible; it depends one finding some key character intact.


                I suggest you take a different approach: contact the Somerset Moth Group ( and see if you can compile a list for your area (bearing in mind their distribution maps, such as


                Then you can eliminate species one by one, and hopefully end up with just one.

                (Maybe you are already familiar with the SMG.)


                Other folks here, and perhaps me, should be able to help you with your other bugs.


                Thank you for your appreciation!



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