Skip navigation
4332 Views 31 Replies Last post: Jun 10, 2013 7:53 AM by MikeG RSS
Currently Being Moderated

Apr 15, 2013 6:58 PM

What trees are these

Hi, can anyone identify these trees; not in leaf yet. Most are the same although there are two different to the right, and there is at least one Silver Birch in the wood.
Thanks, Mike.

Attachments:
  • Currently Being Moderated
    Apr 15, 2013 8:34 PM (in response to MikeG)
    Re: What trees are these

    I think most are ash (or maple), the two on the right with smoother trunks probably beech.

    Teasing question... I guess you are going to give us the answers later in the year when they have leafed-out!?

    • Report Abuse
      • Currently Being Moderated
        Apr 16, 2013 12:37 PM (in response to MikeG)
        Re: What trees are these

        Mike - Well done to you and your developer friend!

        • Report Abuse
          • Currently Being Moderated
            Apr 21, 2013 9:30 PM (in response to MikeG)
            Re: What trees are these

            The green leaves are Crataegus monogyna the common hawthorn.

            (For comparison of C. monogyna and C. laevigata, see http://www.commanster.eu/commanster/Plants/Trees/Rosaceae.html).

             

            The old maple could be one of several, including Acer pseudoplatanum and A. cappadocicum, as well as A. campestre.

             

            The other old leaf: yes, you're right - it is an oak. But I won't say which (yet), so you have something to follow-up. There are clues, especially near the base...

             

            You say the little wood is a tranquil place. One day the weather will warm up. Then it sounds just the place to be, lying on your back in a quietly receptive mood, looking up at the blue sky and its gentle white clouds through the twiggy canopy as it starts to close-over with that wonderful fresh green of newly unfurling leaves. I can imagine the first chiff-chaff singing high in the branches, keeping you company. Where I grew up on the North Downs, there would be a few such days most years. I would treasure the moments, as I sat at the end of our garden, near the Newton Wonder apple that grandad planted for me when I was an infant, 'my' chiff chaff singing in the Norway maple I planted when I was five, and maybe a brimstone butterfly adding a further touch of colour. Finding joy and beauty in simple things is priceless. I hope you continue to enjoy and appreciate your little wood.

             

            Mike

            • Report Abuse
                • Currently Being Moderated
                  Jun 3, 2013 12:53 PM (in response to MikeG)
                  Re: What trees are these

                  Very close (spelling and subspecies)...

                  Lamium galeobdolon ssp. argentatum, variegated yellow archangel

                  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lamium_galeobdolon

                   

                  Mike

                  • Report Abuse
                    • Currently Being Moderated
                      Jun 3, 2013 1:40 PM (in response to MikeG)
                      Re: What trees are these

                      Actually, variegated foliage is not that uncommon in wild plants.

                       

                      If you search for plants with the specific- or subspecific epithet 'maculata', you should find quite a lot.

                      In common parlance, you'll be familiar with 'immaculate' meaning spotless; 'maculate', by corollary, means spotted.

                      The spotting can relate to bark or flowers, not just leaves; and it can be dark or reddish, not just pale.

                       

                      You'll be seeing variegation all over the place now!

                       

                      Mike

                      • Report Abuse
                        • Currently Being Moderated
                          Jun 3, 2013 3:59 PM (in response to MikeG)
                          Re: What trees are these

                          The oak leaf is different from the old one you posted a photo of on 21apr13 (above).

                          They are two of the most common species of Quercus in the UK (and neither is Turkey oak).

                          Can you ID them yet?

                          Look at the base of the leaves, specifically where the blade meets the leaf stem...

                          These will help

                          - http://www.keele.ac.uk/arboretum/articles/oaksatkeele/

                          - http://www.british-trees.com/treeguide/oaks

                           

                          Ash (Fraxinus excelsior) - confirmed.

                           

                          Birch - (Betula pendula) - probably; check it is not B. pubescens.

                          http://www.british-trees.com/treeguide/birches

                           

                          Mike

                          • Report Abuse
                            • Currently Being Moderated
                              Jun 3, 2013 10:28 PM (in response to MikeG)
                              Re: What trees are these

                              Well done. The new oak leaves are sessile oak; the old one is pedunculate oak.

                               

                              However, you are right to have a bit of a quandary. The stem on the latter is a bit longer than normal and the auricles ('ears') are not well developed, so one might argue it represents the hybrid, Q. x rosacea (http://www.british-trees.com/treeguide/oaks/nbnsys0000003847).

                              Sometimes you can resolve such issues with further observation, but sometimes you just don't know for sure.

                               

                              FYI, these might be helpful for future tree IDs:

                              - http://www.nhm.ac.uk/nature-online/british-natural-history/urban-tree-survey/identify-trees/tree-key/accessible.html

                              - http://www.british-trees.com/treeguide

                               

                              Mike

                              • Report Abuse
                                • Currently Being Moderated
                                  Jun 4, 2013 8:25 AM (in response to MikeG)
                                  Re: What trees are these

                                  And later in the year, look for the acorns - with stems (peduncles) with the pedunculate oak, and without stems (sessile) in the sessile oak.

                                  • Report Abuse
                                    • Currently Being Moderated
                                      Jun 4, 2013 12:45 PM (in response to MikeG)
                                      Re: What trees are these

                                      Mike,

                                       

                                      Those are good sessile oak leaves.

                                       

                                      You might consider starting a herbarium (pressed leaves, primarily) to help record the trees/shrubs in your wood. Photos and herbarium specimens are complementary, in that, for instance, photos record colour (fades in specimens) but specimens retain some other details, such as the shape of microscopic hairs.

                                      http://www.funsci.com/fun3_en/herb/herb.htm

                                      http://www.bgci.org/resources/herbaria/

                                      Just a thought.

                                       

                                      Clare gives a useful little table comparing key features of these two oaks

                                      - http://www.thewildflowersociety.com/wfs_articles/april_article.htm

                                      She also makes some useful comments about the hybrid Quercus x rosacea.

                                       

                                      Mike

                                      • Report Abuse
                                          • Currently Being Moderated
                                            Jun 7, 2013 3:55 PM (in response to MikeG)
                                            Re: What trees are these

                                            Could do with a bit more info (preferably photos):

                                            - bark

                                            - shoots showing buds

                                            - remant fruit/seeds (previous years) from the ground below the tree

                                            - single/multi-stemmed and throwing up suckers or not

                                             

                                            You may be able to make some progress with ID by using the NHM's key

                                            - http://www.nhm.ac.uk/nature-online/british-natural-history/urban-tree-survey/identify-trees/tree-key/accessible.html

                                             

                                            Otherwise, we'll have to wait until you can photo this year's flowers and/or fruit/seeds.

                                             

                                            Mike

                                            • Report Abuse
                                                • Currently Being Moderated
                                                  Jun 8, 2013 12:28 PM (in response to MikeG)
                                                  Re: What trees are these

                                                  Mike,

                                                   

                                                  I am pretty sure it is Prunus avium (gean / mazzard / other names but not bird cherry despite the 'avium' epithet; bird cherry is a different species). The bark, branching and general habit are all right, as are most of the details of the leaf you showed yesterday.

                                                   

                                                  I am not 100% sure because the first leaf you showed shows no sign of the pair of glands typical of cherries (and other Prunus). Looking for the glands on your other photos, I find the resolution insufficient... It may be that the glands are there but not discernible due to resolution. And in your first photo, they may have been further down the petiole.

                                                  But also, I am finding images of Prunus avium leaves without glands (or with minute glands), eg. http://www.alpine-plants-jp.com/himitunohanazono/seiyoumizakura_satounisiki_himitu_1.htm

                                                  That proves that the glands are a variable character, which allows your specimen to be Prunus avium. And with your photos, we may simply not be seeing the glands.

                                                  So I am fairly happy with Prunus avium as the ID to species level.

                                                   

                                                  Of course, it could be a cultivar of that species rather than the true, wild, plant. That would allow for more variation, too.

                                                   

                                                  One of the photos here shows the glands very well - http://woodyplants.wikidot.com/prunus-avium.

                                                  See also http://woodyplants.wdfiles.com/local--files/prunus-avium/prunus_avium_sc.jpg

                                                   

                                                  Mike

                                                  • Report Abuse
                                                    • Currently Being Moderated
                                                      Jun 8, 2013 1:19 PM (in response to MikeG)
                                                      Re: What trees are these

                                                      I suspect the time of year does not have a big influence on the size/presence of the glands.

                                                       

                                                      Interestingly:

                                                      'There are a number of factors which influence gland develop-

                                                      ment. In general it may be stated that those conditions which

                                                      produce vigorous vegetative growth favor gland development,

                                                      since on old trees or on trees subjected to unfavorable growth

                                                      conditions, the petiolar glands become much reduced, some-

                                                      times even disappearing,' [my emboldening]

                                                      Extract from 'Petiolar Glands in the Plum (I)'

                                                      by M. J. Dorsey and Freeman Weiss,

                                                      Botanical Gazette, Vol.69,

                                                      http://archive.org/stream/jstor-2470152/2470152_djvu.txt

                                                      (The article includes other Prunus such as cherries, not just plums, in its considerations.)

                                                       

                                                      Mike

                                                      • Report Abuse
                                                        • Currently Being Moderated
                                                          Jun 9, 2013 3:34 PM (in response to MikeG)
                                                          Re: What trees are these

                                                          That is elder, Sambucus nigra

                                                          http://www.british-trees.com/treeguide/elders/nbnsys0000004324.

                                                           

                                                          The fruits make delicious jam. Yes, I know you can make jelly, but I made jam with the berries once and it was superb!

                                                          It roots very freely in water (should you want to propagate some).

                                                           

                                                          Mike

                                                          • Report Abuse
                                                            • Currently Being Moderated
                                                              Jun 10, 2013 12:16 AM (in response to MikeG)
                                                              Re: What trees are these

                                                              Don't get elder (the tree) confused with ground elder (Aegopodium podagraria, a non-woody perennial). The latter can be the devil to get rid of.

                                                               

                                                              Cherries - I'm still with Prunus avium.

                                                               

                                                              Mike

                                                              • Report Abuse

More Like This

  • Retrieving data ...

Bookmarked by (0)

What the symbols mean

  • "correct" answer available
  • "helpful" answer